Hey big shoutout to all the Redditors and Lemmy guys who told me that we can have no restrictions on free speech because if we restrict Nazis they will restrict us if they ever gain power.
Welp, here ya go…like I told you…and many of you blocked and/or banned me for saying it. Ironic.
i felt like the trolls on reddits are just RU stoking anger and division.
You’ll never easily get through to those people. They hold idealism over material reality in many cases.
The best way I’ve found to get even some of them to at least stop and think for a minute is to ask if preventing people from doing things like:
- Screaming slurs next to a preschool
- Publishing deliberately false information to ruin someone’s reputation
- Doxxing someone who was mean to you
…is justified. If they say yes, then maybe unlimited free speech isn’t perfect, and restricting Nazis could be justified. If they say no, then you’ll know they’re a lost cause.
Is the problem the speech or the people tbat speak it?
Great question. Intention matters, so many countries focus on speech that can only be malicious, like incitement to violence in the UK or Nazi salutes in Germany.
If you make the 1st Amendment illegal, the rest of the Constitution cannot be far behind.
if? people have already been blackbagged for their speech. this is just encoding something already in effect.
How tf can u ban a boycott, how is that even possible let alone provable 🤦 Politics aside if I js don’t like a brand that endorses or has ties to Israel would I then be subject to charges. How u trynna force people to buy from certain companies, what if I was bruk, would I be breaking the law? 🤡
Excuse me I saw you drinking flat water where is your soda stream ice this one get this one
This will probably be used to target protestors and organizers of political movements.
Yeah, the boycott itself can’t reasonably be prosecuted. But it can be used to suppress discussion (e.g. organization, coordination) of said boycott.
it will probably use to target protestors, and groups criticial of israel.
Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
And the USSC has definitely ruled that money is equivalent to speech. So boycott activity is logically covered under this Amendment.
If this law passes, a lot of people are going to have a rough year or two until they can get a case all the way to the Supreme Court.
Because republicans care so much about laws they don’t agree with.
Or parts of the religions they thump on about.
Is that legal? It doesn’t sound legal. I’m sure they could make it illegal for US government agencies to boycott Israel because that’s at least partially a foreign policy decision, but private businesses? What are they gonna do, force you to buy Israeli goods?
narrator: it didn’t sound legal because it wasn’t.
Incremental steps into the police state.
How do I boycott Israel in the first place? Not booking my next vacation there? Do I get 20 years in prison for that?
It seems like theatre. How will you ever prove that I chose Burger King over McDonalds for political reasons?
I don’t eat meat. BK has Impossible burgers and McD’s doesn’t. Of course they’ve been coming after synthetic meat too in some places. They’re throwing a fit because a single-digit % of the population had the audacity to opt out of eating meat derived from animals.
I am not vegan or vegetarian, but I still prefer Impossible burgers (and Impossible chicken patties) and Beyond Steak bites. Not only does it at least significantly reduce my meat consumption, it is generally better than the real meat, since it doesn’t have any weird bits and is lower in bad cholesterol. Also, it makes it so the meat I do eat can be sourced more ethically (buying direct from the rancher, hunting and fishing my own for subsistence, getting free range eggs especially from locals) instead of getting the final product and just ignoring what torture went into it.
https://bdsmovement.net/Act-Now-Against-These-Companies-Profiting-From-Genocide
Whatever the legal status of officially boycotting Isreal, there’s still no law against just incidentally not doing business with the companies.
Before someone says they can’t avoid some of these: OK, then boycott the other ones.
Whatever sand you have to throw, throw it in the gears of genocide. Don’t just do nothing.
The Constitution says there’s also no law against actively and loudly not doing business with the companies
They make a surprising amount of things. I noticed a woodworking tool I have was made in Israel. Never expected that.
I have a plastic table I use for woodworking and general carpentry that I later found out might be made in Israel, the brand is Keter. I see they sell lots of outdoor storage solutions locally as well, will avoid that brand in the future. Out of interest, what did you buy so I know what to look out for?
Well, I can think of at least one famous Jewish carpenter.
Nailed it!
You can cross that one off your list
For now; it’ll be back in a few days.
A Bosch router bit
Man, that sucks. I have lots of Bosch tools, although my router stuff is mostly other brands. Thanks for the tip, will be on the lookout.
Didn’t CU rule that spending money is free speech? So isn’t compelling the spending of money compelling speech? Sounds straight up unconstitutional.(as if that fucking matters these days)
Rich people spending money is free speech.
Anti-genocide activists not spending money is terrorism.
AKA the usual.
Wait, doesn’t your argument support their bill?
They’re agreeing with you; they are suggesting that convincing people of what to do with their money is infringing on their “speech.”
My argument is that republicans are never consistent with their policies.
Spending isn’t free speech. The government cannot compell speech. This doesn’t not mean that the government can compell spending (I mean, it sorta can with taxes and fines, but it can’t compell spending to select businesses, markets or groups.)
I agree with you but you’re operating outside of case law and the entire sentiment is moot when arguing this particular case.
Is it saying it’s illegal to “convince”(therefore not the consumer) or it’s illegal to “participate” (meaning the consumer)
Wait you first blame us for not having free speach, because lying about the holocaust is illegal and now you ban boycotting Israel for engaging in a de facto genocide?
How do you outlaw a boycott? It’s not an act, it’s a non-act. An absence of a purchase. How do you distinguish boycott from just not buying something you don’t want or need like any other item. Are we going to be required to put so much of our purchases toward Isreal now?
boycott
probably using to target groups that are protesting against israel.
Ding ding ding.
This is how they “lawfully” throw “dissidents” into the gulag.
Remember…most of what Hitler did was technically legal and above-board. Because they controlled the laws and shaped them as they saw fit.
Wrong think will be punished
the state wants to lock you up, figures out you don’t drink coca cola, You’re on trial for not buying Coca-Cola, or Nestle, or never tried Sabras hummus… straight to jail.
You outlaw a boycott by using violence against those who promote the boycott. It’s not even anything new. Many states have already been doing this. Not to mention recent disappearances of anti-genocide activists.
Violence in service of hegemony is almost the entire purpose of the state.
In other words, yes, precisely, they’re trying to sus out heretics. Don’t want to be mistaken for one? Perform the rites publicly, then.
Not just show your papers, show your recent Israel approved consumer good purchases!
Twitter sued advertisers who said they were boycotting it, and it worked somehow…
Well, we now know what death cult is behind the misery of literally the entire world.
Irony: Nazis are teaching the rest of us who hate Nazis how to hate the Jews
How tf do you ban boycotts? What if I just don’t want to consoom all the time?
Probably that is a threat for anyone spreading boycott movement in social media. So if you post McDonald are shit, bad for the health and do not consume them, you are ok. If you post don’t go to McDonald because they support a genocide by Israel, then it is another story.
And so the fear begins. Its a first step.
Sorry, we checked your recent bank transactions and you haven’t spent enough money at [Insert Corporation]. Please pay the $100 fine or serve one day at [Insert Corporation] as a free laborer.
5 Democrats are cosponsors:
- Josh Gottheimer - NJ-5
- Jared Moskowitz - FLA-23
- Joseph Morrell - NY-25
- Donald Davis - NC-1
- Laura Gillen - NY-4
https://www.congress.gov/bill/119th-congress/house-bill/867/all-info
Dear lord. Why are Dems getting involved in pushing fascism?
There have always been liberal collaborators to fascism, this isn’t new.
Yes, which is why we should vote against democrats forever!!!
TRUMP 2028!!!
Edit: Y’All learned nothing from history.
German communist accelerationists went into the oven just like everyone else.
The German communists went in the oven because the German liberals betrayed their country, empowering nazis to secure their own positions. The idea that ‘the nazis using communists as an excuse to do a fascism is the communists fault’ is 80 year old fascist propaganda.
Who said all Democrats? These specific few are voting against us.
they dont care about the fascism aspect, they care that it guarantees them their seats, just like %90 of all the politicians.
Same as it ever was
Same as it ever was
When Israel started full scale genocide in Gaza, Biden started giving them more money for weapons. Genocide and fascism are the Democratic party platform now.
The American government platform. Don’t try to single out the Dems for this.
I think it’s common knowledge, at this point, that the GOP has been fascist for at least 50 years. Not singling out, pointing out for those still clinging to the idea Dems are on our side.
Maybe, but when they went too hard, he applied pressure. Trump offered to take over and help in the genocide (Middle East Riviera plan).
Democrats are not good, but unfortunately, those idiots are temporarily needed to dump out the fascists.
Politics in FPTP is a bit like a bus, and if you cannot get a bus where you need to go, get one in roughly the right direction.
The amount of “Genocide Joe” Lemmyers who helped cement genocide Trump are complicit in what is effectively a mass starvation. At least Biden tried to step in with supplies when Israel stopped last time.
Biden gave zero genuine pressure to end the genocide. Instead of implementing a weapons embargo, he sent tens of billions worth of weapons used to prolong the genocide.
One Year of Empty Rhetoric From the White House on Israel’s Wars
From the MEMO article:
The Biden administration allowed Israel unprecedented leeway to carry out its military offensive, despite the enormous death and devastation it inflicted on Gaza. Former Israeli ambassador, Michael Herzog, made a startling admission about Biden’s support: “God did the State of Israel a favour that Biden was the president during this period. We fought [in Gaza] for over a year and the administration never came to us and said, ‘ceasefire now.’ It never did. And that’s not to be taken for granted.” His remarks encapsulated a broader sentiment that the White House gave Benjamin Netanyahu all the political space he needed to execute the military offensive, which has claimed the lives of more than 52,000 Palestinians, mainly women and children.
Even the proposal to ethnically cleanse the entire population of Gaza, or ‘empty Gaza of palesinians,’ by removing them to neighboring countries, was first proposed by the Biden admin behind closed doors
The diplomat said Egypt rejected similar proposals from the Biden administration and European countries early in the war, which was sparked by Hamas’ Oct. 7, 2023 attack into southern Israel. The earlier proposals were broached privately, while Trump announced his plan at a White House press conference alongside Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.
When Israel went too hard on siege he did try to step in. Not enough, but the attempted but failed aid pier was far more than Trump has done or would do.
Also, he pressured and got a crossing reopened “Within hours of Mr Biden’s call, Israel said it would open the Erez crossing in northern Gaza and the port of Ashdod in southern Israel to aid, and pledged to drastically improve security co-ordination with groups delivering assistance to Palestinians.”
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-68773400
As I made clear, I’m not defending Biden or claiming he’s good. Thousands have died and I fear if the situation doesn’t change soon, I fear it could be a magnitude of 10 higher. Trump is showing zero signs of any pressure. If anything, he cheers Israel on. It absolutely disturbs me, that through resentment of Biden folks would rather see Trump stay in and have hundreds of thousands of more Gazans die through starvation.
I will say, those that keep propping Trump up are complicit in this. If starvation is happening and you don’t want change, you want this situation.
The first link mentions and puts into context everything you mention and much more. Tens to hundreds of thousands have died under Biden’s watch alone, he is a committed Zionist. The actions were performative and used as a way to justify the ongoing material support for the genocide. You are defending Biden here, you even grossly minimized the death count, not to mention the total destruction of the educational, medical, and historical sites within Gaza.
Pro-palestinian advocates have been pointing this out for the entire duration of the genocide under the Biden admin because it has been clear that a change in foreign policy to a weapons embargo was critical to both end the ceasefire and significantly increase the chances of the Democratic Party to win against Trump. The party’s decision to instead prioritize support for the genocide over focusing on earning as many votes as possible to win against Trump was deliberate. Corporate interests and neoliberalism are responsible for Democrats adoption of fascist policies and controlled opposition to the fascism of the Republican party. The Democratic Party has gone against the will of the vast majority of their constituents, gone against international law, and against the morality of opposing genocide.
There is no excuse.
Manufactured consent for genocide is completely unacceptable.
The rhetoric coming out of the White House, when it has been focused on peace or restraint, rather than continuous war, has been undercut at every turn by its actions. The constant supply of weapons — $17.9 billion of bullets, bombs, shells, and other military aid in the past year — has allowed Israel to keep waging its war on Gaza, and in recent weeks, expand that war to Lebanon and threaten to escalate its conflict with Iran. Despite documentation of U.S. weapons being used in probable war crimes, and credible allegations that Israel is committing genocide in its war on Gaza, the bombs have continued to flow.
March 2024
Trucks filled with humanitarian aid supplies sit in Egypt at the Rafah crossing into Gaza. Many human rights organizations accuse Israel of intentionally blocking aid. Later reports show the Biden administration was aware of the blockage of aid, which is a violation of international law, and continued to send military aid anyway.
On March 22, Congress approves $3.8 billion in military aid to Israel.
On March 25, the U.N. Security Council passed a resolution calling for a ceasefire for the month of Ramadan. The U.S. abstains from the vote, but its representative says that the U.S. supports “some of the critical objectives in this nonbinding resolution.”
“Nothing, nothing has changed about our policy. Nothing,” said Kirby about U.S. policy and support of Israel after the U.N. vote.
May 2024
On May 6, Hamas accepted a ceasefire deal proposed by Egypt and Qatar. Israel began bombing Rafah, where hundreds of thousands of Palestinians had sought refuge, with plans for a major ground operation.
On May 8, the U.S. halts a shipment of 2,000-pound and 500-pound bombs to Israel. Israel goes ahead with a more limited operation in Rafah for the rest of the month. The U.S. begins facilitating aid shipments into Gaza via a “humanitarian pier” constructed by the U.S. military on the beach in Gaza.
Prosecutors with the International Criminal Court, which oversees war crimes committed by nations, requested arrest warrants for Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Defense Minister Yoav Gallant, along with Hamas leaders. The court alleges Israel targeted civilians with bombings and starvation.
On May 26, Israel strikes a refugee camp in Rafah — within a designated safe zone — killing 46 people, mostly civilians, including 23 women, children, and elderly Palestinians. Two days later, Israeli tanks bombard another refugee camp in an apparent safe zone, Al-Mawasi, just outside Rafah, killing 21 others. Among the dead are 12 women. It would be the first of three attacks at the refugee camp in the ensuing month.
The Biden administration rejects calls for further change in policy toward Israel
June 2024
Over the course of the following week, Netanyahu says that Israel would not cease fighting until “the destruction” of Hamas’ military.
On June 8, Israeli forces use an area near the U.S. military’s “humanitarian pier” to launch an attack on the Nuseirat refugee camp. The Israeli soldiers kill at least 276 Palestinian people and retrieve four Israeli hostages.
Netanyahu repeatedly makes clear that Israel will not accept a proposal that involved a permanent ceasefire. Hamas asks for changes to the deal that would ensure that Israel observed a permanent ceasefire.
On June 21, Israel drops a series of bombs on Al-Mawasi refugee camp in southern Gaza, the second attack in as many months at the shelter in the humanitarian zone. The bombs drop around midnight as many lay asleep inside tents and makeshift shelters. At least 25 people, all civilians, are killed in the attack.
You’ve side stepped my key points, so I’ll ask them directly.
Do you prefer Trump or the Dems?
Do you see any realistic alternative to the Dems and Trump?
By all means, send Biden to the ICC later, but the current situation cannot continue. No aid is getting in. This is about as bad as it gets. There are millions of Gazans at risk right now. Are you happy with this situation right now?
Democrats aren’t pushing out fascists, they’re bootlickers and collaborators. They hand Trump and MAGA whatever they ask for. They talk like they’re against Trump but they vote like they’re MAGA.
Well this is 5 people. You cannot really compare these 5 with AOC for example.
The only way Trump goes is through Democrats right now. It’s unfortunate, but unfortunately a fact.
I’m not defending Dems or think they are good, but it is the only realistic play right now.
Wer hat uns verraten…? Sozialdemokraten…
Are they considered Isreali products🤔
Yes. You will be required by law to purchase Josh Gottheimer.
First you get people comfortable with defending genocide in another country, then they won’t be so resistant when you start doing it in your own country.
They were russian astroturfs
Who is they?
Hopefully someone makes a list of brands and companies that you aren’t allowed to boycot according to usa republicans and then publishes that list online on a user friendly website. After all, without that information, people might be unknowingly breaking the law when they start a personal boycot.
Genius. Unfortunately, they will most likely target anti-genocide activist, check their phone for any BDS material and charge them with this.
It is not for the masses it is for the vocal once.
this, i just deleted my BDS apps, will have to rely on manually checking things with a vpn.
