I think she is leaving it up to us to engage in conjecture and it’s hard to imagine, given both this and previous statements, her presenting a position that is anything other than some formulation of liberal zionism, where she wrings her hands about the genocide (whether she uses the term is coinflip) but makes sure to remind you that Hamas needs to be defeated and the hostages broken free.
actually seems like a pretty apt response given her history as a target in certain puritanical leftist crusades. don’t blame her one bit, whatever her take is. people can’t handle shit without it being a bloodbath.
I hate it when those “puritanical leftists” (people who hate Strom Thurmond’s strongest soldier) “target” me by raising objections in the comment section of a 2-hour video I made lecturing them for not voting for Biden by equivocating them with my phase as a self-styled nyanarchist. I need to now make this my entire personality, punching left even as I sit in decadence in the center of a world-spanning hive of imperialism.
I was taking about the Buck Angel wars and how those spilled over to anyone who had ever worked with Contrapoints or just wouldn’t publicly denounce her on Twitter but yes, you may also shift the focus onto something else far more harmless in order to justify it. that is a valid option that is open to you and you were afterall, lectured at (RIP, your soul will find justice in this life or the next 🙏)
I’m clearly deflecting by not guessing based on zero indication which of her sagas you were referring to, yes. How cynical and deceptive of me to justify my nefarious anti-genocide rhetoric by explaining a specific situation where people have a reasonable problem with her (one much more relevant in terms of subject matter because it actually relates to the genocide) instead of vagueposting about something that I just expect people to guess at. It’s also my bad for assuming you were talking about her just because everything you said was about “her history as a target” and not about other people who ended up also being impacted.
And you try to make it like I’m victimizing myself, but I’m not. I’m not the victim of shit. I’m just not some crying freak who starts a fight and then acts aggrieved when other people respond to me instead of just listening quietly and donating to my patreon. You’re the one caping for this woman being a “target” of “crusades.” Do you even hear yourself? You’re the one abusing notions of victimhood and projecting that onto me, perhaps because you know that she’s a damn e-celeb who gets paid a copious amount of money for parasocial attachment and arthouse liberal screeds.
two comments that can be summed up as “I don’t blame her, you people are scary and do scary shit with little provocation” is caping. yeah, unfortunately I can hear my own tone there. this probably did feel like an focused personal attack on you and everything you stand for. with all that in mind I’m just going to skip the part where we make little bulleted lists at eachother and let the rest of all that lay where you left it. I’m enjoying fediverse and you aren’t going to be the debate lord who ruins it for me.
You people are scary and do scary shit with little provocation
This is such a ridiculous further escalation from what you already said, which itself was conflating some small segment of the far left that makes the specific mostly-generational schism in the trans community that you mentioned a driving issue.* A lot of them have the normal neoliberal stance on Ukraine/Russia, and a lot of people with the opposition view aren’t interested in debating about transmedicalism (etc.), something you’d probably readily acknowledge in another context in order to disparage them (which, in isolation, would be fair enough in many cases).
But what do you imagine is being accomplished by saying “You people are scary and do scary shit with little provocation”? What is that supposed to be interpreted as? Surely you actually mean something, so tell me what “scary shit” is enacted by “us people” “with little provocation.” The most generous interpretation of this is that you are shadowboxing.
is caping
Yes, justifying her reactionary nonsense with your absurd caricature is caping. I don’t understand what the confusion is, but maybe you just really buy into this totalizing victim narrative instead of just cynically weaponize it.
this probably did feel like an focused personal attack on you and everything you stand for.
Do you not comprehend anything that isn’t a direct victim narrative? I’m not a victim. She never victimized me. I have no idea how she even could issue a personal attack on me. She posed an argument and people responded to her argument, and now she’s made out to be an eternal victim against monolithic crusaders who “have a history of targeting her” and “do scary shit with little provocation.” I have nothing to do with whatever thing with Buck Angel was going on and I don’t think it’s really to anyone’s benefit for me to try to litigate it, but this doesn’t have anything to do with that and the groups involved don’t map onto each other cleanly at all. Your argument is on the level of a #WalkAway “why I left the left” screed, it doesn’t actually make sense either culturally or ideologically.
with all that in mind I’m just going to skip the part where we make little bulleted lists at eachother and let the rest of all that lay where you left it. I’m enjoying fediverse and you aren’t going to be the debate lord who ruins it for me.
It’s amazing how you can argue all you want and sling accusations but it’s the people responding to those accusations who are “debate lords” ruining things “for you.” Like Contra, the option was always open to you to just keep your mouth shut or else to accept that coming in hot invites a response, but you need to have it both ways. You’re just participating in a debate and then putting “disengage” as a little coda at the end to . . . well, I’m not really sure what you imagine it accomplishes and I suppose I shouldn’t presume. Is it a last word thing? Are you just that self-oblivious? I can’t tell.
Also, please tell me about the “scary shit” that we people do.
*I will mention here for the benefit of other Hexbears that I’m not saying these leftists are incorrect, though a lot of the time people view it as not all that helpful except in cases of someone making the antithesis their platform, like how trying to make a lot of noise about Norm Finklestein being a codger regarding trans issues is not all that productive when that’s not his field of advocacy. Noting it is good of course, and so is pushing back when he says something stupid regarding that or anything else of social significance, but trying to make it the main bit of discourse relating to him instead of his substantial and beneficial scholarship on Israel/Palestine is short-sighted and I think that most people agree with me here. There’s a big difference between a progressive who is backward in some respects outside of their specialty and someone who calls themselves progressive but then makes their specialty being backwards, like what Rowling’s “advocacy” has devolved into over time.
Anyway, my point isn’t to take some specific stance on Buck Angel Discourse^tm, but to say that it’s obviously not relevant to the immediate issues of MENA region geopolitics, which I hoped didn’t need to be specified. I think if someone’s really concerned with trans people in Gaza, they should probably oppose the biggest killer of trans people in Gaza, which is Israel.
gish-gallops off 8 different esoteric Mesopotamian translations of what I said in only 7 miles of text
“literally repeat for me what scary things ‘we people’ do? btw quick clarification for the hexbesties in the crowd…”
nah I can see now this is like a little performance you’re doing. and I gotta admit you do have me monologuing to a brick wall for an embarrassing amount of time. you should have been there in 2016 the gamergate guys would have never seen you coming.
I don’t consider some hexbear being annoying because they misunderstood me to be “scary,” just like you aren’t being “scary.” This also has nothing to do with Contra unless you can demonstrate several different levels of generalizability (I can outline them for you, but you’ve repeatedly said tl;dr so I will wait for a prompt), and it still wouldn’t answer my question because Hexbear isn’t a threat, it’s just a headache. What’s “scary”?
This is still fundamentally you coming in caping for this neoliberal ghoul’s disgusting takes on Gaza because . . . what? Some people got mad at her for platforming Buck Angel or whatever, and now she’s a perpetual “target” of a monolithic left who she is justified in make her entire personality being contrarian towards? Even when the subject isn’t inter-generational trans community disputes in the anglosphere but a genocide in Gaza? None of this makes any sense.
Edit: Also I feel like I’m taking bait by mentioning this as you handwave basically every subject mentioned up to this point, but what does Gamergate have to do with anything?
You are doing the exact same thing contra does, you are the one who started by vague posting, and then when confronted discussed a hyper-specific online thing (the Buck Angel Wars or whatever the fuck that is) that happened, then continue to use that to say that our specific criticism and speculation are incorrect, or that ‘we’, who have absolutely nothing to do with whatever bullshit is happening on Twitter, are somehow responsible for her backing a literal liberal genocidier and repeatedly being sympathetic with the right-wing and actively hostile towards the left (regardless of whatever drama was going on, this shit was going on early for her).
This is literally ‘I have no choice but to embrace fascism because people were mean to me online.’
If you don’t want us to ‘ruin this’ for you, get the fuck up out of our instance then or keep your snide little comments to yourself. There are no victims here.
The post isn’t enough, but her timeline the last few years has a lot of “they would chuck you off a roof” and leftist are so stupid and puritanical for caring so much about Palestine.
I don’t think this screenshot equals “is a zionist” but it definitely wasn’t not a tone deaf answer.
I think she is leaving it up to us to engage in conjecture and it’s hard to imagine, given both this and previous statements, her presenting a position that is anything other than some formulation of liberal zionism, where she wrings her hands about the genocide (whether she uses the term is coinflip) but makes sure to remind you that Hamas needs to be defeated and the hostages broken free.
actually seems like a pretty apt response given her history as a target in certain puritanical leftist crusades. don’t blame her one bit, whatever her take is. people can’t handle shit without it being a bloodbath.
I hate it when those “puritanical leftists” (people who hate Strom Thurmond’s strongest soldier) “target” me by raising objections in the comment section of a 2-hour video I made lecturing them for not voting for Biden by equivocating them with my phase as a self-styled nyanarchist. I need to now make this my entire personality, punching left even as I sit in decadence in the center of a world-spanning hive of imperialism.
I was taking about the Buck Angel wars and how those spilled over to anyone who had ever worked with Contrapoints or just wouldn’t publicly denounce her on Twitter but yes, you may also shift the focus onto something else far more harmless in order to justify it. that is a valid option that is open to you and you were afterall, lectured at (RIP, your soul will find justice in this life or the next 🙏)
I’m clearly deflecting by not guessing based on zero indication which of her sagas you were referring to, yes. How cynical and deceptive of me to justify my nefarious anti-genocide rhetoric by explaining a specific situation where people have a reasonable problem with her (one much more relevant in terms of subject matter because it actually relates to the genocide) instead of vagueposting about something that I just expect people to guess at. It’s also my bad for assuming you were talking about her just because everything you said was about “her history as a target” and not about other people who ended up also being impacted.
And you try to make it like I’m victimizing myself, but I’m not. I’m not the victim of shit. I’m just not some crying freak who starts a fight and then acts aggrieved when other people respond to me instead of just listening quietly and donating to my patreon. You’re the one caping for this woman being a “target” of “crusades.” Do you even hear yourself? You’re the one abusing notions of victimhood and projecting that onto me, perhaps because you know that she’s a damn e-celeb who gets paid a copious amount of money for parasocial attachment and arthouse liberal screeds.
two comments that can be summed up as “I don’t blame her, you people are scary and do scary shit with little provocation” is caping. yeah, unfortunately I can hear my own tone there. this probably did feel like an focused personal attack on you and everything you stand for. with all that in mind I’m just going to skip the part where we make little bulleted lists at eachother and let the rest of all that lay where you left it. I’m enjoying fediverse and you aren’t going to be the debate lord who ruins it for me.
This is such a ridiculous further escalation from what you already said, which itself was conflating some small segment of the far left that makes the specific mostly-generational schism in the trans community that you mentioned a driving issue.* A lot of them have the normal neoliberal stance on Ukraine/Russia, and a lot of people with the opposition view aren’t interested in debating about transmedicalism (etc.), something you’d probably readily acknowledge in another context in order to disparage them (which, in isolation, would be fair enough in many cases).
But what do you imagine is being accomplished by saying “You people are scary and do scary shit with little provocation”? What is that supposed to be interpreted as? Surely you actually mean something, so tell me what “scary shit” is enacted by “us people” “with little provocation.” The most generous interpretation of this is that you are shadowboxing.
Yes, justifying her reactionary nonsense with your absurd caricature is caping. I don’t understand what the confusion is, but maybe you just really buy into this totalizing victim narrative instead of just cynically weaponize it.
Do you not comprehend anything that isn’t a direct victim narrative? I’m not a victim. She never victimized me. I have no idea how she even could issue a personal attack on me. She posed an argument and people responded to her argument, and now she’s made out to be an eternal victim against monolithic crusaders who “have a history of targeting her” and “do scary shit with little provocation.” I have nothing to do with whatever thing with Buck Angel was going on and I don’t think it’s really to anyone’s benefit for me to try to litigate it, but this doesn’t have anything to do with that and the groups involved don’t map onto each other cleanly at all. Your argument is on the level of a #WalkAway “why I left the left” screed, it doesn’t actually make sense either culturally or ideologically.
It’s amazing how you can argue all you want and sling accusations but it’s the people responding to those accusations who are “debate lords” ruining things “for you.” Like Contra, the option was always open to you to just keep your mouth shut or else to accept that coming in hot invites a response, but you need to have it both ways. You’re just participating in a debate and then putting “disengage” as a little coda at the end to . . . well, I’m not really sure what you imagine it accomplishes and I suppose I shouldn’t presume. Is it a last word thing? Are you just that self-oblivious? I can’t tell.
Also, please tell me about the “scary shit” that we people do.
*I will mention here for the benefit of other Hexbears that I’m not saying these leftists are incorrect, though a lot of the time people view it as not all that helpful except in cases of someone making the antithesis their platform, like how trying to make a lot of noise about Norm Finklestein being a codger regarding trans issues is not all that productive when that’s not his field of advocacy. Noting it is good of course, and so is pushing back when he says something stupid regarding that or anything else of social significance, but trying to make it the main bit of discourse relating to him instead of his substantial and beneficial scholarship on Israel/Palestine is short-sighted and I think that most people agree with me here. There’s a big difference between a progressive who is backward in some respects outside of their specialty and someone who calls themselves progressive but then makes their specialty being backwards, like what Rowling’s “advocacy” has devolved into over time.
Anyway, my point isn’t to take some specific stance on Buck Angel Discourse^tm, but to say that it’s obviously not relevant to the immediate issues of MENA region geopolitics, which I hoped didn’t need to be specified. I think if someone’s really concerned with trans people in Gaza, they should probably oppose the biggest killer of trans people in Gaza, which is Israel.
“you could have just kept your mouth shut”
gish-gallops off 8 different esoteric Mesopotamian translations of what I said in only 7 miles of text
“literally repeat for me what scary things ‘we people’ do? btw quick clarification for the hexbesties in the crowd…”
nah I can see now this is like a little performance you’re doing. and I gotta admit you do have me monologuing to a brick wall for an embarrassing amount of time. you should have been there in 2016 the gamergate guys would have never seen you coming.
I don’t consider some hexbear being annoying because they misunderstood me to be “scary,” just like you aren’t being “scary.” This also has nothing to do with Contra unless you can demonstrate several different levels of generalizability (I can outline them for you, but you’ve repeatedly said tl;dr so I will wait for a prompt), and it still wouldn’t answer my question because Hexbear isn’t a threat, it’s just a headache. What’s “scary”?
This is still fundamentally you coming in caping for this neoliberal ghoul’s disgusting takes on Gaza because . . . what? Some people got mad at her for platforming Buck Angel or whatever, and now she’s a perpetual “target” of a monolithic left who she is justified in make her entire personality being contrarian towards? Even when the subject isn’t inter-generational trans community disputes in the anglosphere but a genocide in Gaza? None of this makes any sense.
Edit: Also I feel like I’m taking bait by mentioning this as you handwave basically every subject mentioned up to this point, but what does Gamergate have to do with anything?
Stop projecting.
You are doing the exact same thing contra does, you are the one who started by vague posting, and then when confronted discussed a hyper-specific online thing (the Buck Angel Wars or whatever the fuck that is) that happened, then continue to use that to say that our specific criticism and speculation are incorrect, or that ‘we’, who have absolutely nothing to do with whatever bullshit is happening on Twitter, are somehow responsible for her backing a literal liberal genocidier and repeatedly being sympathetic with the right-wing and actively hostile towards the left (regardless of whatever drama was going on, this shit was going on early for her).
This is literally ‘I have no choice but to embrace fascism because people were mean to me online.’
If you don’t want us to ‘ruin this’ for you, get the fuck up out of our instance then or keep your snide little comments to yourself. There are no victims here.
It’s not puritanical to be against genocide, it’s not that hard
The post isn’t enough, but her timeline the last few years has a lot of “they would chuck you off a roof” and leftist are so stupid and puritanical for caring so much about Palestine.
Obligatory cognito hazard warning .
https://nitter.net/ContraPoints