He called me a setter and a nazi out of the blue, and I asked him if he slanders everyone or if he has a reason for saying that about me, then he replies with this legendary quote:
If you’re Amerikan, then you live in the bowels of the single most brutal settler-colonial entity to exist in the modern era. “Settling” is not a once-and-done action; it is a constant state as long as you are on settled land.
Sooo they should go settle somewhere else? Where do they expect them to go? Or maybe they just want US to kill themselves. Hmm, maybe Hexbear isn’t that well-reasoned at its heart…
It’s fucking easy to virtue signal “colonialism bad”. It’s much harder to propose a solution that doesn’t involve even more mass death of innocents. If someone doesn’t have primum non nocere at the heart of their politics, they are not healing anything. They are just doing blood for blood.
Well Italy, Japan and Germany all did some bad stuff in WWII so why don’t we swap places.
let’s not.
It would be the source of many memes
Lmao, these pricks are actually hurting their own base by alienating themselves so hard.
Sucks to suck 🤷
They swear they aren’t a far right false flag / psyop, but why do that work for free? The first time I encountered them was enough to conclude that democracy was the worst idea in human history.
Ethnic cleansing and ethnonationalism is okay as long as it’s anti-West, clearly.
There’s a lot of validity to pointing out that colonization is an ongoing process. Just ask any native tribe that’s lost their fight over sacred lands so some jackass oligarch can pump oil the short way.
I’m not sure “ethnically cleanse all people with European blood” is the answer.
There’s a lot of validity to pointing out that colonization is an ongoing process. Just ask any native tribe that’s lost their fight over sacred lands so some jackass oligarch can pump oil the short way.
I agree, it’s just, you know, “White person living” isn’t “continuing colonization”. Shit like the Dakota Access Pipeline is continuing colonization. Seems to be the issue with a lot of tankie takes. They find an actual issue that needs to be fought, and proceed to get nearly every detail of it wrong.
It’s because their legitimate anger gets harnessed by bad actors.
Taking illegitimate actions fucks up the legitimacy of legitimate anger. Why should anybody relinquish power if the other side can’t do it any better?
That’s not to say we don’t need a change. But if you’re poor, blaming the rich, then you’ll be rich, blaming the poor later. Neither breaks the cycle.
Anyone said this?
well i got banned form lemmy.ml for calling attention to communists threats, so clearly there is a double standard
Those people presented a problem so it was fair that they got eliminated
As a white American descendant of colonial settlers, they’re not entirely wrong, it’s just that their anger is misdirected. It should be directed at those in power rather than regular people. It’s unreasonable to expect all descendants of colonial settlers to leave, but it’s not unreasonable to ask them to be aware of their history and how the systems of power and control that were put in place then are still going strong today.
Given I can’t see your original comment they were responding to I’ll reserve judgement regarding whether what they said is reasonable.
Honestly it all is ludicrous. You absolutely should know your history but trying to hold every white person in existence liable for the actions of people who died long before we were all born is silly. You can’t change the past you can only make the future. You might as well blame my dog for the suffering of the past. It accomplishes nothing. What’s worse is that some people have developed a complex about the history especially if they of a race that was harmed historically.
Don’t blame people alive today for mistakes and cruelty of the past. That is unfair to everyone involved.
trying to hold every white person in existence liable for the actions of people who died long before we were all born is silly.
Nobody is trying to do that, and you know it.
If you click on the link you can see someone call for my death only because I’m american, so yeah.
Also I was banned from Lemmy.ml for being a bigot when I called them an idiot, but the incitement of violence is still there
I’m sorry, I didn’t mean to invalidate your experience with the hate trolls and HexBlyat edgelords. I do see it and do not deny it. I was calling out the boomer on his strawman argument.
You have to be careful not to go too far in the other direction as well. We may be blameless for atrocities that were committed by our ancestors but we do bear some responsibility to address the lasting effects of those atrocities and to oppose the continued settler-colonial project of which we are still part.
And don’t take this the wrong way, responsibility does not equal guilt. Every US citizen is not guilty of invading Iraq, for example, but every US citizen does bear some responsibility to oppose the systems of power that allowed such a thing to be done in our name.
I can’t say I agree but I respect your opinion
Yeah, but then people use that logic to deny that there are structural inequities that need to be fixed.
i’m curious though. what about prisoner states?
were the prisoners considered colonists, or just the lords considered colonists?
It might surprise you that the prisoners weren’t the ones in charge of any so-called prison colonies.
i’m not challenging you. just asking questions, since most white folk in australia are called settlers despite the majority having ancestry from prisoners.
I don’t know enough about the history of Australian colonization to speak authoritatively about it. If I had to guess I’d say that those who found themselves on the wrong side of the British empire’s laws were given some kind of choice and found the option of being sent to settle Australia preferable to whatever alternative was presented. In that sense they could be considered settlers, but it could possibly have been a choice made under duress.
That being said it wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest to hear that they were similarly brutal towards the aborigines as settlers in America were towards the native Americans. History is complicated and there is no black and white, but there are rights and wrongs and it’s important to recognize that while genocide can be explained, it cannot be excused.
well said
Thanks I was making a comment much like yours where I was being compassionate towards an Israeli who was conscripted at 18 like 20 years ago and didnt want to hurt anyone and worked as a secretary, and who seems traumatized by the experience, and who is very outspoken about the Israeli genocide…
She’s a victim of the machine too, and her hands are mostly tied, so I think that its unfair to say she’s a bad person for being in the IDF
I guarantee you they are also American or from a settler country. Racist too
Sometimes I wonder if it is time to return to the trees
100%
I mean they aren’t wrong. Just because the natives have been exterminated doesn’t change the fact that they were here first.
Native Americans have not been exterminated at all, we are very much here. We’re like the Borg, we adapt. Example: [Cherokee.org]
I’m pretty sure exterminated is the wrong term…
The “natives” are still around you know
A fraction of a fraction remain. Entire tribes have been lost to time. Exterminated is appropriate.
No, it’s really not. Please look into the Cherokee Nation, you will be shocked how far we’ve come.
Are they wrong about the solution being exterminating all Americans?
no no guys you are mistaken bovinepollinatingfly told me that it’s a wholesome community because it’s communist /s
The whole settler thing is never going to resonate when you’re accusing someone whose family has been there for generations of being complicit.
I understand I benefit from colonialism, but my hands are kinda tied! I It’s like I don’t even own property the super wealthy are the real colonisers! We mostly went from beneficiary to bystanders, to victims as well. And I call out genocide every chance I get but to the hexbear I might as well have done the atrocities myself…
Just do the best you can with the power you have.
Nobody wants to heart this, but: All of the abuses of power on the large scale are personal issues that have continued, unresolved, into the large scale, because we haven’t resolved them on the small scale.
Do your part. Process your shit. Through that, you gain the perspective to use what power you do have well, without fucking yourself or others over in the process.
Yeah when I joke with my native buddies about the whole “stolen land” thing (which absolutely white colonizers stole land from natives in Canada) I’m always like “well boys, they didn’t give any to me and my family, because we still don’t own shit.”
The working poor are part of the victims, we aren’t part of the victimizers. Myself personally, I wouldn’t shed one single fucking tear if all the generational colonialist pigfucks had to return all the land they own to native Canadians.
Why not? Amerikkkans don’t have an ethnicity or culture anyway
They do tho
Uhhhhh… then we’d be settling some other place??? how do yo not get this?
It’s cute how hard you try to be inflammatory.
That’s about as bad as it gets. That person is unhinged!
Some truth there… but kinda odd to be spazzing about america when Israel is genociding people to settle Palestine as we speak lol
Man people out here really just trying to make everything related to the conflict, huh? Switch off lol
nah, mate
alright, well, just be mindful of history because it gets very complicated very fast.
Kinda weird to bring up Israel when Russia is genociding ukraine, too. (I can whataboutism also)
You mean, kind of like how Russia is currently trying to settle in Ukraine like the colonizer they are?
Or how China is colonizing African countries right this very moment in order to steal their resources?
Alright China colonizing Africa is a bit a of a stretch? you got some DD for that?
That’s like when western corpo send their “executives” into a new market they are not immigrants, they are expats…
If you’re Amerikan, then you live in the bowels of the single most brutal settler-colonial entity to exist in the modern era.
They are not fully wrong. What were you banned for?
My post was deleted for being rude to someone calling for my death…
EDIT: Im banned now! apparently calling attention to threats is a bannable offence!
Get out of there while you can
Normies in shambles… my empire good, my empire strong…
Colonialism was terrible, but technically all land is settled. Humans always moved and settled somewhere else, even before we could be classified as homo sapiens, and that was often brutal too when we encountered others. There’s ultimately no space where we truly came from or belong to.
All land is not settled until treaties are honoured. See #LandBack
I’m not sure what you’re trying to say here. Land Back is about colonization. I’m very specifically going back to human origins and how we, as homo sapiens, spread across the globe. This includes what we consider “natives” in America, Australia, Europe, and other parts of the globe where we did not originate from. All those places were settled by us and were not inhabited by humans originally.
Im pretty sure we all came out of africa
You realize how big Africa is? And it isn’t like we just plopped in existence there.
You’re right we gotta dig up all of Africa to look for the oldest skeleton first
“Amerikan”
It’s just a phase. They like the aesthetic and won’t ever do anything.
dessalines be like: death to all americans is just the edgy thing kids are saying these days
Amerikans, please, or Amerikkkans if you aren’t into the whole brevity thing. The branding of the phase is important. Remember, label out when you’re bashing colonialism!
